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discussion

Forgiveness

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asybes
Dec 11 2002
08:03 am

Hi. Over the past few days, I have been wondering about something. I’m a freshmen in High School, and the other day we were talking about forgivness. In Numbers 15: 30-31, it talks about how anyone that Blasphemes the Lord should be cut off from his people. My teacher said that this had something to do with forgivness. However, I dont quite see the conection. The way I took it, it is saying that there is no forgivness. I could be totally wrong here, but for the better part of two days, I have been thinking about it and wondering what it meant. Can anyone explain that passage, and also forgivness?

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JabirdV
Dec 11 2002
08:25 am

Just a thought, but check out vs 29 as well. It seems that there is a difference between those who sin willfully and those who do so out of ignorance (or lack of consciencness). It would seem to correlate with Hebrews 10:26-27. Forgiveness for those who know no better and those for who have repented, condemnation for those who know better and refuse to repent after knowing the Truth.

Like I said, just an idea. Any other thoughts fellow *cinoites?

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kristinmarie
Dec 12 2002
12:58 pm

Yes, it does seem like a harsh passage at first glance. However, I would agree with JaBird in that it draws our focus to the intent of the person—to willingly, with full knowledge, sin against God. In a way, this passage is a bit reassuring: already we see God’s grace and mercy in his forgiveness to those who have sinned unintentionally.

Why did your teacher choose this passage to illustrate forgiveness? What else did he or she have to say about the topic? Many times Christians refer to the “..if your enemy strikes you, turn the other cheek…” verse as an example of how one should forgive everyone everything. This Old Testament excerpt gives a different sort of view—an example of God as ruler, parceling out judgement as it is deserved.

On somewhat of a sidenote: how do you all at cino think about forgiveness? When do you feel like you’ve forgiven someone? Do you think it’s possible to really truly, forgive people completely?

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kristinmarie
Dec 12 2002
01:04 pm

“…we’re trying to get down…to the heart of the matter…duh duh da duh duh….world seems to shatter and I think it’s about…forgiveness….forgiveness…even if, even if, you don’t love me any more…

Darn Rod Stewart. Now, like me, you can all have him in your heads while you think about forgiveness. :)

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BBC
Dec 12 2002
09:10 pm

On that verse (and the unforgiveable sin thing), several wise people have suggested to me that we miss the point of that verse because we don’t see that it is a kind of jewish joke. The unforgiveable sin, the ultimate blasphemy, is to willfully reject God. The only reason there is no forgiveness for that sin is that willful rejection is such a turning away that we aren’t even hearing what God is saying — I forgive you, come back.

Seems to me it is kind of like when my 4 year old wants something so badly she is crying about it because she thinks she can’t have it, and I am trying to tell her that it is okay, she can have that thing (lets say a brownie) but she is crying so hard that she can’t hear the good news.

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JabirdV
Dec 13 2002
02:52 am

When do you feel like you’ve forgiven someone? Do you think it’s possible to really truly, forgive people completely?

Here is an interestinglittle study by Nancy Missler on the subject of forgiveness. I know I link to this site alot, but I find alot of very provocative insight in this ministry…

Hopoe it helps a bit.

http://www.khouse.org/articles/nanscorner/20020801-426.html

I have found that forgiveness is often a mindset. I don’t always feel like I have forgiven but I KNOW I have made a decision to forgive them and hold onto that when I start feeling a bit (or alot) unforgiving. Not much of an answer, but how can we truly let go of something? It is usually that the something won’t let go of me. The pain caused by others to my life often haunts me and nags at me…so I just have to reckon with that and hold to the commitment I made to forgive them. Sometimes I feel it, most of the times I don’t…but my commitment is always there. Make sense?

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asybes
Dec 13 2002
07:50 am

So what your saying BBC is that no matter what, God will always take us back, and we are the ones that dont hear them?

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BBC
Dec 13 2002
10:09 pm

Hey Asybes, Welcome.

Um, what do you mean by “them”?

I do indeed believe that no matter what, God will take us back. The joke is, the only time he wouldn’t take us back is when we don’t come back but keep running away.

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asybes
Dec 14 2002
03:39 am

Oops. Sorry, I meant Him.

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JoyBirdV
Dec 14 2002
04:44 am

So sorry, kristinmarie, but it was Don Henley who put that lovely song in our heads. :)

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kristinmarie
Dec 15 2002
12:06 am

kristinmarie blushes profusely

I actually heard that song used once for special music in a church service.