catapult magazine

This seemed like too much of a deviation to continue with it on Adam’s topic.

Maybe having more responsibility and having higher profile work/jobs necessitates getting paid more, and maybe we need some people to be millionaires so that they can invest again in our country, and maybe we need to cut their taxes so that their current surplus of funds can be even larger and they can ‘improve’ our economy. I am not convinced, but I also know embarrassingly little about economics. I am trying to learn though.

My confusion begins when someone connects making $2 million a year with the ability and right to consume $2 million dollars worth of goods in that same year. Then again this is America and we all deserve more than we have (I know I do) so maybe they consume $2.3 million in one year. Is this really necessary? Does it do anyone good to drive a car worth $100,000 or pay for $100+ plates of food? Does it do our country good? I mean this literally.

Is this significantly different than me consuming $10 thousand in a year since I could most likely live on less and give more?

Maybe the privilege of making over $1 million a year should exist in deciding where that money should go, and I don?t mean Ultimate Electronics or Best Buy. Maybe the privilege and challenge is to decide where it could be best used and not where it would yield the most return.

I currently work at a movie theatre here in Sioux Center. It has been open for 8 months and has been doing fine. There are somewhere near 30 investors who invested around $300,000 so that this place could be here, and in five years there is a good chance that their investment will still be worth about the same. But it has brought something to this community that otherwise could not be here. Are things like this going on all around me without me knowing it?

Yeah, my voice is getting sore. . .

You are presuming that people who make $2 million a year actually spend it – and then some. How do you make this connection? No one who makes X amount of dollars per year actually spends X amount of dollars per year on consummable goods. Your post jumps to a lot of conclusions that are incorrect.

You see, an interesting fact that studies show is the emergence of the “millionaire next door.” There’s even a book out about this now, I believe. If you’ll read my posts under the topic about Democrat candidates, you’ll see that most of today’s millionaires are actually former middle-class families. Being a “millionaire” today doesn’t have the same cache as I think you’re giving it (i.e. Rockefeller, duPont, Morgan). There are thousands of bona fide “millionaires” who live average-looking lives and who are, indeed, giving their money away, investing it and saving for retirement, especially as people live longer than they used to.

Two common characteristics of today’s millionaires include living below their means and driving used vehicles, believe it or not.

I’d also just like to add that I think that millionaires pay mucho taxes, and lots of them actually do good things. I’m not making any moral claims about any millionaires being good or evil (or about their cars for that matter), but just equating making money (or earning from investments or whatever) with spending it on consumables does not make sense.

I can totally understand what mrsanniep said about millionaires driving used cars. How do you think they got to be millionaires? (Hint—I don’t think it’s by frivolously spending. These people probably still save ketchup packets from McDonalds and use them at home)

- No one who makes X amount of dollars per year actually spends X amount of dollars per year on consummable goods. Your post jumps to a lot of conclusions that are incorrect. -

Actually, many people live beyond their means and it is not just those in the lower income brackets. I know a gentleman whose entire business is based on buying debt from credit companies at a reduced rate and taking over the payments. The majority of people whose debt is his business are doctors and lawyers. They make $100 – 150 000 a year, but they have grown accustomed to a lifestyle which costs $300 000 a year. They have umpteen credit cards which are all maxed all the time, and they are in serious financial trouble. Everything about our culture encourages us to live beyond our means and you while there may be a lot of millionaires who don’t look like millionaires, there are many more people who are trying their best to look like millionaires, who aren’t.

Can someone tell me how to do that cool “quoting” thing? And why is it that even though I log on with my name and password, my wife’s signature keeps showing up on my posts? This is Henry. You’re not the only one that needs to ask for a little patience, Matthews.

You’re right – there are plenty of people who are NOT millionaires who overspend. However, most millionaires don’t overspend. That’s the difference we need to distinguish in this discussion.

Part of the point I am poorly trying to make is that while it is possible and even likely that many millionaires do not ?overspend their means? they are still spending too much money on goods and services (that is where the question about my own living and spending comes in).

And as for those that invest some of their money, I am not convinced that most of those investments do not fall where a decent profit can be gained instead of where it can do the most good. So their possible influence on the trends of society fall to their increased profit, with some ?un-gleaned rows? being left for salvation army or the likes of CINO.

No, they aren’t.

Unless you have inside access to the household budgets of the average millionaire (someone who earns at least $1 million a year), you shouldn’t speak in such sweeping terms about how they spend their money. Actual research and interviews with average millionaires indicates they live well under their means, drive vehicles that are, on average, 6 years old, and they aren’t leading lifestyles we associate with celebrities.

Are you trying to say that everyone – rich and poor – should never spend more than X amount of money a year (like your $10,000) and give the rest away?

In addition to making investments, that yes, earn interest and make more money, that millionaires make proportionately more donations to charity (including organizations like *cino and churches and others) than others. Of course this is partly speculation, and partly an informed guess.

One of the problems with understanding what millionaires do or do not do is that most of us have no access to a “real millionaire” that we know of. Most of them don’t advertise their worth in terms of dollars. I think that actually getting to know one, and maybe examining his/her relationship to money would yield quite a complex picture of how millionaires do or do not spend money.

I think that it’s interesting to think about the idea that perhaps millionaires spend just like everyone else does, but on a greater scale (more responsibility).

“Are you trying to say that everyone – rich and poor – should never spend more than X amount of money a year (like your $10,000) and give the rest away?”

No, I am not saying that.

I am saying more than that. I am saying that I feel guilty for even spending that much each year, and am frustrated that some people spend much more than that each year. Of course it is easier to rant and rave about others than criticize myself.

So I guess I am saying that.

I do think it’s kind of ridiculous to get angry with other people for spending more money than you do without knowing really how much they give versus how much they spend.

I also think it’s fruitless to worry about it, too, when you don’t have all the facts. If you feel guilty spending $10,000 a year, that’s your business. It’s presumptuous in a way, also, to think that “the rich” don’t wrestle with the same issues of spending and giving that you do.

The Bible does not condemn wealth or money. It condemns the hold money can have over people’s lives and the way in which it is used. Worrying about the spending habits of others seems to have a hold on you that isn’t altogether good, either.

Jesus spoke frequently about the wealth of others Annie.

I feel guilty when I think about the money I waste every year. And I applaud Matthews for feeling the same way. I don’t think he’s wrong to be asking the questions he’s asking. His assumptions, though they may be somewhat errant, search for the truth. When I get to heaven I want to hear “Well done good and faithful servant” and in my opinion that should be spoken on every facet of my life. If I pull in 100 grand this year (snicker snicker) live a comfortable lifestyle with 50, waste $10K on this, that and the other unneccesary “cool” thing and give $40K to charity I’m not convinced that’s enough.
Correct me if I’m wrong Matthews, but that’s how I see your arguement. I see your posts more introspectively than I think Annie does.

One more thing. Matthews, don’t make any more excuses for your posting. I think it’s fine. We’re all friends here despite our sometimes heated discussions. Lose (or change) the sig.